HelloMiners Forum Reporting Banned from HelloMiners? (Appeal) gbt2008642

(Appeal) gbt2008642

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Re: (Appeal) gbt2008642

Postby gbt2001 » Tue Aug 20, 2019 12:07 am

So, before I begin, I am making this post to state once and for all the issues that were discussed and why personally I still am not satisfied by the ban. I honestly understand and wouldn't have it any other way that I would have ban time for what I did. The arguments lies in how long the ban time should be based on what was done and the evidence provided. Spartan and Camel both gave a lot of time trying to explain why they think my ban should stay. However, I still believe that the main issue regarding this was this time didn't seem to be put into actually reading the report, looking into what was the evidence, or asking other people involved in this. As you will see below, and from what was discussed, the reason the discord was so long in the first place was I had to rexplain my report as they didn't know what was in the logs with oza and they didn't understand the portion in regards with the auto fish and nuking despite the explanation in the report. The main reason I am not just pasting the entire discord is because it is massive and extends over many days. I again want to state while neither of us liked talking in discord (we both complained in the discord) I am posting all the parts including the counter arguments and my response to them so that I can explain myself perhaps clearer since we stopped talking and so that other people can have an opinion with all the facts and what was discussed.

Auto Fish

This was one of the major issues I had with spartan and camel the entire discord, as this was a central piece of my argument for why the ban should be 7 days rather than the 3 months. If you know what I am talking about, thetruetechie was banned for afk fishing for 7 days a while back.

What makes this unique is that he wasn't banned for using a machine, but as you can see, it seems he is auto recasting and fishing at this time. This is different since that means he had to have been using a mod (auto fish is one that does this) that would allow for techie to auto fish. While this doesn't seem relevant, it is relevant to the central argument since it states that the usage of a mod (if it is doing something automatically without human interaction) is a 7 day ban despite the usage of a mod. An argument camel brought up is

KingOfCamelsLast Tuesday at 9:14 PM
and we talked to techie he tried saying he was at the screen and tried to show proof not it
so it would be impossible to go back and prove he was using a mod even if he was

While that does seem to state that he wasn't able to prove it, there are a few things wrong with this statement. First is that this states you need a confession to ban someone which has never been the case in regards to afk (since that isn't possible) or hacking. With this concept, someone could be xraying but them saying "I just randomly mine and hit diamonds because luck" would get them off the hook. That is why we have videos in reports in the first place. Another thing is that it is impossible to afk fish with a mod or machine. Since techie didn't have a machine, he had to be using something since fish spawn randomly; you can't just keep pulling back the line at set intervals since it needs to be close to exact. Later this was brought up during the argument over whether I was afk which I will go into more detail in a different section.

SpartanPride7Last Wednesday at 9:26 PM
ppl using a auto fish mod is afk
they dont respond to messages


The second thing we discussed is why I wasn't listed under an afk ban. Spartan's main argument was that I was not afk and thus should not have been banned for afk.

[15:06:21] [Server thread/INFO]: <~Gbt> :D
[15:07:00] [Server thread/INFO]: SpartanPride7 issued server command: /msg richie_rich123 gbt uses kill aura
so, about 40 seconds before i messaged richie, u were talking in chat
and then seconds after richie said ur name, u responded
about 2 minutes
is how long we watched u

SpartanPride7Last Wednesday at 9:13 PM
[15:08:54] [Server thread/INFO]: gbt2008642 issued server command: /
while we were watching u

[15:09:43] [Server thread/INFO]: <Mod ~Richie> gbt
[15:09:43] [Server thread/INFO]: <SoccVader> wb
[15:09:44] [Server thread/INFO]: <~Gbt> wb
a second after richie unvanished and said ur name
u said wb
meaning u were watching the chat, and were actively playing

I am going to answer these all the same way I answered this in the discord. As I use a laptop, I change my keys around to be more able to move. My Z key is attack, my O is right click, my arrow keys are how I move, and my enter key is my /. In order to stop and read chat, I needed to click my enter key. I quickly read chat and reclicked enter to continue using the mod. The main reason I would look back at the screen every few minutes is so I wouldn't be banned and so I could make sure no one was asking for me in chat which would have revealed (since mods were online) I was afk and doing something (which obviously didn't work). I wanted to post this so people can see what I said without having to look deep into the fourms. (Also disclaimer, it says I edited the post, but mods can see the original and I didn't change anything, I clicked edit to quote it since the url and I hit submit to exit).

I just want to start out by saying sorry. I got annoyed clicking because my finger was hurting and I was trying to watch stranger things at the same time so I used a killaura so I didn't have to click with the sword and could instead just walk around and kill the mobs. While they still did damage, I see why action was taken.

I just want to cite that this has been banned before once, and resulted in a minimal/non existent ban time for the player in question. As can be seen in the report, it wasn't even acted upon and they instead focused on the ban that was in the rules.

Based on this, I don't see the need for a permanent ban or some high month(s) ban since it isn't something that has been handled as something even to be factored into ban time.

I am posting this since I am listed as perm ban and I don't think mods know what to do about this.

Just want to say sorry again, and I hope I can be forgiven. At least now I can focus on the show fully now and I am fine with a ban.

As was stated above, I stated I was afk in my apology post (which I would like to add was the only evidence they had to ban me in the first place since the video was later revealed to be corrupted). While I could be lying which is what spartan pointed out, I want to point out the mods watching did not follow through on even checking since they assumed I wasn't, and I had no reason to lie in my apology since I immediately posted it and assumed they had a video that wasn't corrupted. Another thing I want to point out is if you are going to use the post as the sole piece of evidence to support my ban, cherry picking isn't something that should occur, since in real life, once something is entered into court, all parts can be used, not just the portions that are convenient for the person that entered it. The post illustrates I was watching stranger things, and the discussions over the hours with the camel and spartan established what I was doing.

I wanted to also highlight this portion, since this demonstrates what I did is still afk thanks to da_kilis ban.

SpartanPride7Last Wednesday at 10:01 PM
kili did not interact for 2 minutes. u interacted every minute

gbtLast Wednesday at 10:01 PM
that is why there is this whole argument
Spartan no

SpartanPride7Last Wednesday at 10:01 PM
how are u suddenly not actively playing

gbtLast Wednesday at 10:02 PM
ugh one sec let me scroll up and find the thing
There was more than 2 minutes between :smile: and the /
And since when is the time a factor unless it is always since that isnt afk

SpartanPride7Last Wednesday at 10:04 PM
yes thats correct, though we also didnt start watching u until 40 seconds after that message
but thats unimportant really

gbtLast Wednesday at 10:04 PM
No it isnt

SpartanPride7Last Wednesday at 10:04 PM
as u interacted with the game often

gbtLast Wednesday at 10:04 PM
It is important

SpartanPride7Last Wednesday at 10:04 PM
how so?

gbtLast Wednesday at 10:05 PM
Because it shows lack of interaction for 2 minutes. And me watching show then stopping the mod for a second to read chat then turning it back on so I could continue watching is afk
Idk why you are trying to convince me and yourself it isnt
it is

Alex's Ban

So, one major thing that was discussed as well was the whole alex situation and its relation to my whole ban. Here is the discord discussion initially on the subject.

I wanted to continue and perhaps come back to this portion later since it would be more productive to focus on the powder machine. I wanted to first start out by bringing up the case of the apple glitch. You said that alexs ban related to the apples, and I wanted to say that the apple thing relates more to my case then I think was given credit for. I was involved significantly in the apple case and had one of the largest fines out of the whole thing, and one major reason it was a fine was because of the post I made regarding how I was introduced to the whole apple situation in the first place. Spav was the first person I saw doing it and he was a mod at the time. Because I saw a mod doing it and he didn't voice any concern about the whole apple situation, I began using it under that pretense and it is the reason it was fines and nothing more. When it comes to the powder machine on the farm, I didnt even use it like the apple machine and only used it for testing under lag conditions and demonstrating to oza, nate, and red. Alex spawned in a million and a half forsals converting minecarts to cash. I don't see how that is different from what I did in the slightist, especially considering I made like 300f in the worst case scenario (input cost, etc.) and that somehow warranted the loss of millions and a 1 month ban time.

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 9:12 AM
alex didnt use a glitch or a dupe, she abused something that was put there intentionally
u abused a minecraft glitch. different than what alex did

gbtLast Friday at 10:40 AM
What I am saying is it is the same situation with a mod not expressing disapproval and it continuing. I don't think anyone agrees that this portion of the ban should stick anyways since how much it was used and the circumstances around it just don't warrant this action.

gbtLast Friday at 10:50 AM
This is a direct quote from the rules
If there is a glitch with a plugin or aspect of the server that can lead to an unfair advantage for a player, report it immediately to staff. If it is not reported and instead abused for ones benefits, the player will be banned based on the duping punishment.
Abusing a plugin is the same as abusing a Minecraft glitch under this but you didn't eliminate Alex's property, you didn't follow through on apples, etc. The idea mine is somehow different is a lie and the only thing that is different is alexisturnt was a favored player. Everyone knows Alex's ban was sketchy considering the new rules that were placed just for her and even former mods involved at the time stated it was a biased situation
However, I want to hope that isn't the case and instead I think we should look at this as an example of what should have been done in my ban. Also, I want to state how the rules said if you report to staff. The Apple glitch is a perfect example, as spav didn't explicitly say anything was bad about it so people began to use it. This was kind of the main reason why harsher action wasn't taken. This precedent implies that it doesn't need to be explicit, and if a staff sees it and then does not state anything particularly negative, then the player can continue.
And I want to point out that the player continuing for personal benefit didn't even happen, so I am confused on this whole thing
It sounds like people just wanted me to lose my property.

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:25 PM
no one cares ab ur property
is what u did a glitch?
does the rules call for the duping ban when that glitch is used? yes
does the duping ban call for a reset? yes

This was discussed over multiple sections and was an interesting discussion considering spartan stated alex didn't glitch because it was intentionally put there by mods. First, I don't think mods intended alex to bypass all the portions that made it reasonable and just place minecarts on the track right at the end.

Mod Approval

The contention with what oza said was another crucial part of the discord. As I suspected, the mods did not read the logs provided and simply responded the same way they did when I first brought up oza saw it.

so why did u go to oza to approve it?
because u are friends?
and worked together in a business?
and i say approve lightly, as he didnt approve it as one would
he didnt know what it did
how it worked

As you can see, spartan stated oza didn't know what the machine did. This is a large issue since he knew what the machine did since I explicity stated. This portion got quite heated since I had gotten annoyed by the fact I made a giant appeal and spent days finding logs and precedents that weren't looked at in the 2 week span. I restated in the discord for the third time and here is how it went down.

Why would I want other people see what was made for the company
[15:49:25] [Client thread/INFO]: [CHAT] [me -> Mod ~Oza] well at least nate can finally make concrete equal cost
[15:49:32] [Client thread/INFO]: [CHAT] [me -> Mod ~Oza] and lower
[15:49:39] [Client thread/INFO]: [CHAT] [me -> Mod ~Oza] since we can ignore dye cost now
sry spartan you going to keep lying
because this is what was in the logs

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:30 PM
ok do u have the log where oza says cool but i have no idea how that works or something
or are u just leaving that out rn

gbtLast Friday at 2:30 PM
[15:48:45] [Client thread/INFO]: [CHAT] [me -> Mod ~Oza] wait did you see the powder machine?
[15:48:51] [Client thread/INFO]: [CHAT] <~Cake> Oza can you take an aerial photo of something and discord it to me pls?
[15:48:55] [Client thread/INFO]: [CHAT] [Mod ~Oza -> me] yeah but i don't get it
Its all in the appeal which you would know if you read the logs

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:31 PM
yeah but i don't get it

gbtLast Friday at 2:31 PM
He saw the machine
He knew what it did

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:31 PM
how would someone approve a machine that they dont understand

gbtLast Friday at 2:31 PM
he lied toy uo
and you ban me

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:31 PM
so ur saying he did know exactly what it did?
and he only said it didnt to protect himself?

gbtLast Friday at 2:31 PM
He knew what it did

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:31 PM
because if thats what ur saying, i will speak to him as that is not a staff member that is going to be working with us
and he will be removed
ok i will speak with him.

While I don't like this part since I like oza, this should have been an established fact and not something that took 3 times and almost 3 weeks to establish as a fact. In this case, I am not blaming oza and I feel kind of bad about how this portion went down, but it was the truth and it is annoying that mods didn't already know that. Also, the yes was for he knew what it did, not to protect himself since idk why he said what he said, and idk whether spartan and camel misinterpreted what he said or what. From here, we went back to alex.

Alex Part 2

It doesnt matter this happened with the apple glitch and that was handled the same way you handled alex
which shows favoritism if I end up with this ban

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:33 PM
stop saying favoritism, no one cares about that

gbtLast Friday at 2:33 PM
Tell that to ncr
who said there was favoritisim

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:33 PM
like u think staff huddle up and say ok lets get gbt banned now?
whatd ncr say
(also remind u ncr was a staff for like a month and has been gone for 8 months now)

gbtLast Friday at 2:34 PM
pulling up one sec
My bad it was Luc "I would like to see the staff try and shut this appeal down. All these points are more than fair and completely valid. Especially the ones about Oza and about the other people banned for making money this way. I am noticing a large flip-flop in the way staff is enforcing bans. I recall when we banned alex that certain members of staff (which I will not explicitly single out as I cannot remember how many) were really big on not giving the full ban sentence, and the reform being brought up only at that time when a well respected player was facing an extremely long ban. This is not fair, especially not taking away all of gbt’s money, items and property. @Admins you should be pulling logs of how much money he made off of selling concrete in the time since the machine was built until the last time a block was placed inside of it and doing the math to fine him of that money and only that money he made off of it. You all went completely overboard on this ban and did a sloppy job at compiling evidence. It is really disappointing to see this big of a slip-up happening. Ban fairly as per the precedent that you all set, this isn’t 2013 anymore.

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:39 PM
was ncr even part of the alex discussion? pretty sure he was removed before that but maybe im wrong

gbtLast Friday at 2:39 PM
It was luc

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:39 PM

gbtLast Friday at 2:40 PM
mister misery I think is his user
He was mod

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:40 PM
anyway, since u continue to bring up alex ill tell u what ive told all the other ppl who asked

gbtLast Friday at 2:40 PM
I bring it up because it is a very similar situation as mine, the rules say glitch plugin or minecraft, not just minecraft and she used it for months and made millions and was just fined
I made 300f max and it wasnt even for the forsals and I was banned for duping
you see how that makes me and everyone else think that is a stupid ban

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:43 PM
alex's ban was 4 months, yes. alex was banned under the:

"If someone illegally gains money in a way that is not a direct disadvantage to another player, the ban time will be 1 day of ban for every 200F gained in this way. The money or property that was gained will be taken away from the account."

so, she would have been banned for a couple decades. at this same time, we were discussing someone's appeal (can't remember their name at the top of my head, someone starting with a?" who was banned for multiple years for ban evasion. before alex's ban happened, we were discussing making a max ban time of 4 months. alex then got banned so we decided we might as well start with her since we'd be implementing the rule later on. so that's why she was banned for 4 months and money taken away. the fine was put bc she abused a privilege given by the city tier program.

the 4 month rule was then changed to what is now 6 months very last minute because of internal staff disagreements

gbtLast Friday at 2:43 PM
The survey was always 6 months

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:44 PM
perhaps. dont remember all of that, but i do distinctly remember alex's ban being set at 4 months bc that is what the rule was gonna be at the time

This portion isn't fully relevant but there are alot of things that can be gathered from this. One thing is the part where spartan quotes the rules. This seems to be a questionable portion since the duping ban includes glitching and misusing features from plugins. That seems far more pertinenet to what alex was doing than the other portion they were banned for, especially since alex didn't show a mod what they were doing unlike me. Considering this in general, I still believe that I should be banned under this at the most considering the situation with oza, what I am bringing up in the next section, and the complete lack of usage of the machine for personal gains as illustrated from the csn logs published in my ban report.


After alex, we turned to discussing whether I should be counted under the duping

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:45 PM
why didnt u test it in single player?

gbtLast Friday at 2:45 PM
I did I downloaded it from the internet

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:45 PM
also, do u honestly think what u did was not a glitch?

gbtLast Friday at 2:46 PM
1) It works on multiple versions 2) I assumed amoni and ash were using it since they keep all their concrete at 38f despite charging 27f for 8 ink sacs which means they are making negative forsals or just being unproductive 3) I showed oza (a mod btw) who didnt state any issue with it

So from here, we began discussing more into detail and got into the major contentions on why admins believed I should remain banned for duping even though past precedent and the mod interaction.

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:47 PM
but u used it before oza even saw it

gbtLast Friday at 2:47 PM
To show nate and red and to test it to see if it worked on the server

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:47 PM
not that it really matters, as thats not gonna change anything, but if we want to get down to details, u still duped before anyone would have approved it
(even tho he didnt approve it)

gbtLast Friday at 2:48 PM
God spartan, you are actually ridiculous

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:48 PM
let me ask u something gbt
remember that chest dupe a few months ago? where ppl could dupe all the contents of chests in a chunk by writting some things in a book and quil?

gbtLast Friday at 2:49 PM

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:49 PM
ok well

gbtLast Friday at 2:49 PM
staff never told how it was done

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:49 PM
oh well that is how it was done
been patched by now
anyway, one player was duping literally double chests full of rare vote keys

gbtLast Friday at 2:49 PM
well gj, did they consult a staff member, no
I showed a staff member
doesnt matter if we were friends or not
they are staff

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:49 PM
so, if i saw that glitch
said cool
wanted to test it with some diamonds in a chest
and it worked
should i not be banned since i was only testing a dupe?

gbtLast Friday at 2:50 PM
You shouldnt if you showed a staff member after testing

This went on for quite a while and while it does bring up a good point, it does illustrate the stubborness of this argument. The whole time, it was basically an argument on whether I had gotten permission to use the machine. While it wasn't a explicit, it was implicit and is similar to the approval of the apple glitch. The apple glitch as I stated previously had staff not explicity saying it was legal but since they didn't seem bothered and some even used it, it was considered to be a fine instead. The constant examples that were brought up after this continued to bring up the same points and I didn't want to simply restate the same thing on here as this is already long.

The next portion is referring to how in the video, the person states apparently that it is a glitch

ok so the same video used in the ban topic

gbtLast Friday at 2:55 PM
Like how I downloaded his stone gen among other things

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:55 PM
the same video that explicitly says how it works

gbtLast Friday at 2:55 PM
I already talked this over with camel

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:55 PM
and how it is a minecraft data conversion glitch

gbtLast Friday at 2:55 PM
read that
so we dont have to do this again

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:56 PM
and how it is a minecraft data conversion glitch

gbtLast Friday at 2:56 PM
so we dont have to do this again
I didnt listen with volume
Read what I said to camel
I didnt listen with volume

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 2:56 PM
oh wow thats so convenient
so so so convenient

While I do agree with this point, as if I knew this, I would not have made it, this doesn't solve the fact that oza saw the machine, and the fact the video was only went to to get the download information. This whole situation in general is not something I think should be representative of the servers justice system in general. This is actually a small section of this entire topic because this was discussed in length with camel as well on a separate day. Camel tried everything including trying to trick me into a corner but nothing came of it because I wasn't lying. This was one of the many reasons I was disappointed at staff since I showed spartan this discussion but he brought it up again anyways.

The Reason

This part was the reason why I made the machine for Agora in the first place.

gbtLast Friday at 3:00 PM
How do they get all their prices at 38f
Thats why I built it in the first place
so Agora could compete with whole blocks prices because there isnt a way with their dye costs

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 3:01 PM
have u thought that maybe theyre taking the loss to undercut ur prices?

gbtLast Friday at 3:01 PM
to make all prices the same

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 3:01 PM
like lots of companies irl do

gbtLast Friday at 3:01 PM
No spartan
because those prices were there before Agora even started
they were there before I was even banned for xraying

SpartanPride7Last Friday at 3:02 PM
ok so maybe they had ink farms? ppl selling them dyes? maybe they went out killing squids for hours on end? but bc u thought they were duping, u thought u could too

gbtLast Friday at 3:02 PM
Explain to me, how does someone have ink sacs for sale for 27f for 8 (which is the cost to make a stack of powder) then have to factor in 25f for sand and gravel
They didnt
They dont have an ink farm
Amoni and ash told me

This portion I wanted to add since I didn't want to leave any portion of the discord. The main reason I built it was also I thought it was common practice since I never understood how whole blocks was making all the prices consistent at 38f per stack prices. I never used it though past testing and showing to the other members of Agora, and I still think this did not warrant a ban of this magnitude or even a ban at all. I also want to state I doubt Amoni uses this and amoni and ash have suppliers since I recall them saying that, but I just thought it was used since it was on ilmangos channel and he is very commonly making videos for machines that people on the server copy onto hm.


Overall, I think admins while they did a good job at taking time to talk after their response, they did not thoroughly read what I even posted on my appeal and they cherrypicked lines that would assist them in their opinion. Appeals are hard to do, and I understand mine was long, but considering there was 2 weeks to read and nothing from my appeal seemed to be taken with any seriousness speaks volumes about staff. I am still extremely annoyed that I had to restate opinions and explain things that shouldn't even be needing explanations since they have nothing to do with the fundamental questions, like why did I need to answer the reason for the machine again, and why did I have to post the logs if staff were just going to ignore anyways. With killaura, it doesn't matter what the opinion is, what matters is the evidence. The evidence used was my apology post, which includes me stating I was afk. It doesn't matter that you have doubts as an admin. If you can ban people without proper evidence or cherry pick evidence to fit your scenario and get what you want without acknowledging the other parts, what kind of system is that. Although I doubt staff will even read this as demonstrated numerous times already, I would prefer that we simply move on. I offered a compromise in discord due to the lack of major evidence to prove otherwise but I was rejected.

I also want to say sorry about the length and grammar. This took forever to make and I zoned out towards the end. Also to make this shorter, I left out the nuking discussion but there isn't much to add since that was restating the points in the appeal.
4 people like this post.

Re: (Appeal) gbt2008642

Postby natedogg723 » Tue Aug 20, 2019 3:01 pm

I dont get why staff is trying to add new details to the rule saying how you cant tell a staff member that is your friend, that you work with etc but the rule doesnt say we need that?? like can staff stop bringing that up like its in the rule when its not.. we reported it to a staff member after he tested it when it was finished being built, chances are he never even sold that powder to anybody. And spart its kinda hard for a staff member to be the first person to see it when there was rarely ever staff online.. especially at that time. So please be fair to gbt, because u guys are bending the rules to keep him banned and it makes no sense and is completely unfair to gbt.. accept the facts man
"Work for a cause, not an applause" -Unknown

Re: (Appeal) gbt2008642

Postby Cocraven2018#1 » Tue Aug 20, 2019 6:13 pm

natedogg723 wrote:I dont get why staff is trying to add new details to the rule saying how you cant tell a staff member that is your friend, that you work with etc but the rule doesnt say we need that?? like can staff stop bringing that up like its in the rule when its not.. we reported it to a staff member after he tested it when it was finished being built, chances are he never even sold that powder to anybody. And spart its kinda hard for a staff member to be the first person to see it when there was rarely ever staff online.. especially at that time. So please be fair to gbt, because u guys are bending the rules to keep him banned and it makes no sense and is completely unfair to gbt.. accept the facts man

unban him i need to do a order xD.
Owner Of White Water Industry

Re: (Appeal) gbt2008642

Postby natedogg723 » Sat Aug 24, 2019 4:44 am

Cocraven2018#1 wrote:
natedogg723 wrote:I dont get why staff is trying to add new details to the rule saying how you cant tell a staff member that is your friend, that you work with etc but the rule doesnt say we need that?? like can staff stop bringing that up like its in the rule when its not.. we reported it to a staff member after he tested it when it was finished being built, chances are he never even sold that powder to anybody. And spart its kinda hard for a staff member to be the first person to see it when there was rarely ever staff online.. especially at that time. So please be fair to gbt, because u guys are bending the rules to keep him banned and it makes no sense and is completely unfair to gbt.. accept the facts man

unban him i need to do a order xD.

dont ask me.. done with this server unless gbt gets the duping ban removed, because its bullshit and they are just too lazy to do the right thing
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"Work for a cause, not an applause" -Unknown

Re: (Appeal) gbt2008642

Postby 4K606 » Sat Aug 24, 2019 4:47 am

Ehh If you leave it leaves a gap in the market for something besides agora or GNSR.
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